Selene Snippe (WOLEP member, Netherlands): “My goal is to bring my clients’ businesses to the stage of being fully developed and fully protected on a legal level”

WOLEP: Using typically Dutch imagery, your website talks about businesses “blooming into legal maturity”. A very powerful figure of speech! What does “legal maturity”, business-wise, mean for you as a Lawyer?

Selene Snippe: My definition of maturity - and with legal maturity I'm not talking about the maturity dates in your contract - is the state of being fully developed. My goal is to bring my clients' businesses to that stage, of being fully developed on a legal level. I do that, by helping them build the right legal foundation for their businesses, and by drafting and negotiating their contracts so that they have the right contracts in place, in order to achieve their goals while being legally protected at the same time. That is my goal for my clients. Once they have achieved that stage, that is what I call “blooming into legal maturity”.

WOLEP: What's the risk of setting up a business but not developing the right legal framework, maybe not paying attention to the finer details of the contracts? What is the risk for that business?

Selene Snippe: Well, the risk would be that, for example, if you don't have the right terms in place, under the law that is applicable, you could incur full liability and full risk for the products and services that you deliver. I think that is the main risk that you should watch out for.

WOLEP: It seems pretty obvious you’re very driven, a risk-taker. How difficult was leaving a top Amsterdam law firm and setting up your own operation? What’s the best thing that happened to you ever since?

Selene Snippe: I've always had an entrepreneurial spirit. And I've always had my own ideas. I always felt like the way law is practiced right now is a bit outdated in a sense, and at some point I thought: "I know I want my own law practice someday, so why not start now?". To many people, it may seem risky to start your own business, but I consider it just as risky being in employment, honestly. Yes, you don't have a fixed salary every month, but I feel I've always had a fear of not getting my salary raise, the bonus that I felt I deserved, or my contract not being extended, for example. And yes, the fear that I might be laid off someday if the economy is not doing well. So, to me, it was just as risky staying in employment, as it was starting my own business. So, I guess my anxiety levels are the same right now! (laughs) In that sense, nothing has changed for me. But I love being in business - I feel like once you have that bug in you, you can't get rid of it, and you just have to go for it.

WOLEP: Who influenced you most during your career so far - and why?

Selene Snippe: This may sound a bit corny, but it was and always has been my mother. She did not have a corporate job for quite a while when raising me, she fully dedicated herself to raising me, and once I was old enough, she started working. She started at the bottom, climbed the corporate ladder, and now she's in a great managerial position at an auction company. That company has a net worth of over 7 billion dollars, and she is responsible for the online auctions in Europe and the Middle East. She has really proven herself, and she has shown me what work ethic truly is, in that process. I really respect her for that. I always go to her for advice on business matters, when I am struggling or having a bad experience. She always listens to me and gives me great advice. My mother has always lifted me up and she has been my cheerleader. I think having her as my support system, and her guiding me through the corporate world, has influenced me most. She has definitely been my biggest influence.

WOLEP: How would you describe the legal culture in the Netherlands? Are businessmen / women conscious of the need of proper legal counsel and do they treat it responsibly in practice?

Selene Snippe: I think so, yes. Entrepreneurs are very aware of their legal needs and where they need to go. It's in our culture that the Dutch are very headstrong and opinionated, but also very conscious about their spending, also when it comes to legal costs.

So what I often get with Dutch clients is - especially when they're relatively new to business - that they have done all the legal research beforehand themselves. They tend to tell you what they think you should do, and whenever they can do something themselves, they will, just to cut costs. They will also put limits on how many billable hours you may spend! (laughs)

The Dutch are very practical and pragmatic, in that sense, but they also put a lot of emphasis on their business relationship, on trust. Which means that, sometimes, Dutch businessmen and women are more lenient when it comes to putting everything down on paper, even though it may be to their disadvantage.

To give you an example of that, I once was negotiating a shareholders' agreement between the founders of the target company and an investment firm. The founders were rolling over into the company as managers, and they did not want to have their children in the non-compete clause. They felt like that would limit their children and their future opportunities. And, as a lawyer, I told them: "No way! We should put the children in there too! They know everything about the business!" But, as they wanted to keep that relationship strong, and built on trust, I followed my client's wish. After all, your duty as a lawyer is to inform and advise your clients, but you can not impose anything on your clients.

WOLEP: The gig economy is strong in your country. How important is it for a freelancer to have the Lawyer by his side when negotiating a contract? Do you have many such Clients?

Selene Snippe: I do have quite a few clients who are freelancers. A lot of them find me through IamExpat, the website for expats in the Netherlands. So, I do have quite a few of those who come to the Netherlands and set up a sole proprietorship and work as a freelancer here. I think it is very important to have a Lawyer by your side, especially here, because you have to make sure that your freelance contracts and the way you conduct your business as a freelancer comply with the legal requirements under Dutch tax laws.

The Dutch government is actually trying to combat what we call "false self-employment", meaning that someone is working under the same conditions as an employee but is hired as a freelancer because it is less expensive when the company doesn't have to pay the payroll taxes. But the Dutch government is trying to combat that because they feel if you work as an employee, then you should get the same legal protections as an employee. If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, then it is a duck! Then we have to apply those rules, right?

You have to be very specific in your terms of your freelance contract as to the freelance relationship. You have to make sure that it has the terms that reflect the freelance relationship, and that you do not include terms that reflect an employment relationship, such as vacation days or sick leave, for example. If it turns out that it is an employment relationship, then the Dutch tax authorities may impose payroll taxes and social security premiums, and they will likely impose that on the principal, the person that hires the freelancer. However, the principal may include in the contract a tax indemnification - allocating that risk to the freelancer, which the freelancer has got to watch out for. That is one of the reasons why it is important to have a lawyer by your side, who ensures that the right terms are in place - so that, for one, it is considered a freelance relationship, and secondly to make sure that those risks are not allocated to the freelancer.

WOLEP: Did you notice any fluctuations in this department, during the recent pandemic?

Selene Snippe: I believe the Dutch gig economy was pretty much stable during the COVID-19 pandemic. Also because I think, in the case of employment, in the Netherlands you can not lay off your employees as quickly as maybe in the US, for example. Thus, no, I really haven't noticed a big difference in that.

WOLEP: You set up a “contract shop” on your website (which is very actionable, by the way) in order to streamline the relationship with your (potential) Clients. How did this idea arise, and how did your Clients react to it?

Selene Snippe: As I previously said, the Dutch - and also beginner entrepreneurs from around the world - are very pragmatic, and try to do everything themselves at first, before they incur legal costs. Often they will just grab a free contract template online that does not comply with the applicable laws, and does not provide them with the legal protections they need in their specific situations. In my opinion, there is no such thing as a “one size fits all” when it comes to contracts.

I wanted to provide tailor-made contracts that are still affordable and make myself more approachable. Therefore, I provide contracts on a fixed fee basis in my contract shop, and I tailor them to their specific needs and their specific situations. So, they know exactly what the costs are beforehand. My clients have responded very positively to this concept – while telling me they were too afraid to approach a lawyer, because they didn't know what legal costs they would incur and they'd rather save it for later. But then again, they also are aware of the fact that not every free contract is of high quality. And with me, they know exactly what costs they will incur, because I provide that transparency. People have told me that they really like that.

WOLEP: You provide legal assistance in relation to businesses operating under Dutch law but also UK law. What made you “extend“ into Britain?

Selene Snippe: That came about because I focus on international businesses that may be based here in Netherlands, but they conclude international contracts with different parties around the world. I have studied International Law, and I am very much acquainted with both law systems and have dealt with the common law system of the UK as well. When it comes to international contracts, there is more freedom in the choice of law, and it turns out that commercial parties prefer the common law system over the civil law system, which the Dutch legal system is. Because, under the common law system of the UK, there is definitely more freedom of contract. It is less prescriptive than the civil law system, especially the one in Netherlands. Many provisions are implied when it comes to Dutch law, and parties cannot contract out of certain provisions. As a direct result, less importance is placed on the terms of the contract, and the principles of fairness come into play way quicker with Dutch law. As opposed to UK law, where what the contract says is law, basically. You know exactly what your contract incurs under common law, as opposed to the Dutch law where the Court may decide otherwise than what is contracted.

WOLEP: How did Brexit complicate matters - for example, for a British company to run its business in the Netherlands?

Selene Snippe: Brexit definitely influenced businesses. Because the EU and the UK have concluded trade and customs agreements, it means that now the UK is a third country for the EU. That means that there are changes for the entrepreneurs in the Netherlands doing business in the UK, and the other way around, especially when it comes to entrepreneurs who sell goods, exporters and importers. They have to deal with more stringent customs requirements. And that just prolongs the process, whereas before, we just had the free trade of goods, and things went a lot faster. And now there is a little bit of a delay in that.

I don’t think it has necessarily affected the number of goods traded, but the process is longer. So, they have to deal with that. And then businesses also have to deal with the posting of employees, in the Netherlands and in the UK. That has also been more complicated. Because first the freedom of movement applied, for people as well. We don't have that anymore. People have to apply for visas now. And that complicates things for international businesses.

WOLEP: Even if it’s early days into your membership, you’ve got a sense of WOLEP by now. What are your expectations down the road?

Selene Snippe: I would love to host a WOLEP webinar one day. I would have to think about what to present, but I would love to host one. I saw WOLEP did a great webinar comparatively, in July. I love these kinds of events, that bring lawyer colleagues together. It was a surprise to me, that WOLEP also provides those kinds of webinars.

I actually joined WOLEP because I want to broaden my network of lawyers outside of Dutch borders, because I deal with mostly international businesses, and I want to be able to provide them with a network of legal experts in different countries, so that I can refer my clients to them if they need legal help in another country.

That is why I initially joined WOLEP. But then I realised that WOLEP has a lot more to offer, just like these webinars, and I'm very excited to join one of them.

Are you a legal eagle with a passion for collaboration? Join forces with other legal professionals and elevate your practice to the next level. Don't wait, sign up now to WOLEP and connect with like-minded lawyers today. Register your account here.